About

The lore

Every fall, when the wild persimmons turn orange and drop, folks across Appalachia and the Ozarks split a seed open to read the coming winter. Inside each seed is a small white sprout. Depending on how you look at it, it looks like a spoon, a fork or a knife.

How to read a persimmon seed

1. Find a tree near you. The lore says a seed forecasts winter where its tree grows, so store-bought fruit won't count. Any persimmon tree will do, from the native persimmon (Diospyros virginiana) to Fuyu and Hachiya trees (Diospyros kaki).
2. Wait for ripe fruit. Persimmons ripen from September through November.
3. Clean and soak the seeds. Rinse off the pulp. Then soak the seeds in warm water for about an hour to make them easier to cut.
4. Split each seed the long way. Stand it on its narrow edge and cut lengthwise, not across.
5. Look at the white shape inside. Is it a spoon, a fork or a knife? If you can't tell, that's fine. Pick Can't tell.
6. Split a handful. Many people split a few seeds and go with the shape that shows up most. Send a seed of that shape as your forecast seed. You can add the others to the collection if you like.

Safety note: Persimmon seeds are hard and roll. Hold them with pliers or a clamp, cut away from your fingers, and let kids do the looking, not the cutting.

How old is this custom?

This is the best we can tell from old newspapers and books. If you know of an older one, we'd love to hear about it.

The oldest persimmon weather sign we've found in print is about the size of the crop. In the fall of 1852, the Richmond Despatch said a big persimmon crop meant a hard winter was coming. A column from the Warrenton News was reprinted in the Raleigh Semi-Weekly North-Carolina Standard on January 19, 1853. It said the winter had been "remarkably mild" so far, and joked that the persimmons had "augured a good deal of mud." The same crop sign is no. 6095 in the Frank C. Brown Collection of North Carolina Folklore. It stayed in print into the 1960s.

The earliest seed reading we've found was about a harvest. In 1931, the Sikeston Standard in Missouri said a spoon in the seed was "a certain sign of a big crop." The seed was tied to wishes, too. Hyatt's Folk-Lore from Adams County, Illinois (1935) says you'll find a knife, fork and spoon in a persimmon seed (no. 1284). It also says to make a wish while you open the seed to see them (no. 6574).

The earliest winter reading we've found is from Pierce City, Missouri, in 1935, printed in the Sikeston Standard. There, a spoon meant a mild winter. A knife and fork meant a cold, harsh one. The meanings used today were in print by 1976, in the Circleville Herald of October 22.

We searched the big folklore collections from 1899 to 1964. None of them list the seed as a winter sign. The Farmers' Almanac and others say the custom goes back to the 1800s, or to the Cherokee or other Eastern Woodland peoples. None of them cite a source, and we couldn't confirm either claim.

Today, TV weather forecasters from Missouri to North Carolina split seeds on air most falls. The Farmers' Almanac puts out a yearly "Persimmon Forecast." Italian websites describe the same seed reading with Diospyros kaki, and most give the same meanings. They call it an old farm tradition but give no date, so it's unclear how it relates to the US custom. Japan has a saying about the crop, like the older US sign: "a big persimmon year brings heavy snow."

Does it work?

No one has shown that it works.

The "utensil" is the seed's embryo. That's the tiny root and first leaves that would grow into a new tree. Its shape is set months before winter comes. The NC State Climate Office notes that at least half of all seeds show a spoon. So "snowy winter" is the most common call, no matter what the weather does.

Extension offices and universities say there's no science behind the seed forecast. Some people quote track records, like "thirteen out of seventeen years" for a Missouri extension office. Those come from TV segments and from the Farmers' Almanac grading its own calls. None of them is a published study.

Each spring, we compare the forecast seeds sent here with NOAA weather records, using the same rules every year. We post the results on each winter's forecast page. We also show how often you'd have been right by always guessing spoon.

About Persimmon Place

Splitting a persimmon seed is an old fall custom. Persimmon Place keeps a public record of what people find, to help the custom carry on from year to year.

Each fall, people send in a split seed with a photo. A curator checks it and adds it to the Seed Collection. Each person's forecast seed also counts toward the forecast for the coming winter.

The rules

• One forecast seed per person per winter. This is the seed that counts toward the forecast. If you split a few, send one with the shape that came up most. If a curator turns it down, you can send another.
• Up to 10 extra seeds per winter. After your forecast seed is in, you can add more seeds to the Seed Collection. They don't count toward the forecast.
• Every seed needs a photo of the split seed, so anyone can see what you saw.
• If you can't tell the shape, pick Can't tell. Those seeds are kept in the collection but never counted.
• Give the place where the tree grows, not where you cut the seed.
• Seeds from any persimmon tree count. Store-bought fruit goes in the collection but not the forecast, since nobody knows where its tree grew. A store-bought forecast seed still uses up your one for the winter.

How the forecast is counted

Each winter's forecast is the most common shape among that winter's forecast seeds. If two shapes tie for the lead, it's a split decision. Seeds must be cut and sent between August and January. A seed cut in October 2026 and one cut in January 2027 both count toward winter 2026-27. Seeds can't be added to a past winter.

How seeds are checked

After each winter, we check every counted forecast seed against NOAA's weather records for the area around its tree. The rules are the same every year.

• Winter means December through February.
• The area is the tree's NOAA climate division. That's one of 344 areas NOAA uses to track climate in the lower 48 states. We find the tree from the location you share, or else your ZIP code or town. If we can only place it by state, we use records for the whole state.
• Each winter is compared with the 30 winters from 1991 to 2020. If it beat at least two-thirds of them, it counts as above normal. If it beat a third or fewer, it counts as below normal. Anything in between is near normal. NOAA sorts its own outlooks into the same three groups.
• A spoon is right if snowfall was above normal.
• A fork is right if the average temperature was above normal, a mild winter.
• A knife is right if the average temperature was below normal, a cold one.

By chance alone, about one seed in three would be right. About half of all seeds show a spoon. So we also show how often you'd be right by always guessing spoon, scored the same way at the same trees.

We score NOAA's winter outlook the same way, at the same trees. When it leans warmer, colder, wetter, drier or near normal, it's right if the winter landed in that group. When it gives "equal chances," it hasn't made a call, so it isn't scored.

Where the data comes from. Temperature and precipitation come from NOAA's climate division records. Snowfall comes from weather station records gathered by NOAA's Regional Climate Centers. Each station's winter is ranked against its own 1991–2020 winters, and we use the middle rank of the stations in the area. The outlook comes from NOAA's Climate Prediction Center. Town and ZIP locations come from the Census Bureau.

Your data

To have your seeds, their photos and your account deleted, ask on My seeds. Until a curator deletes them, you can cancel the request. The privacy page says what we keep and who can see it.